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Home » Community » Coffee corner » Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"? [message #15482 is a reply to message #15469] |
Sat, 26 April 2008 02:36 |
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tvanriper
Messages: 85 Registered: September 2007 Location: Germantown, MD, USA
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luzr wrote on Fri, 25 April 2008 07:52 |
tvanriper wrote on Fri, 25 April 2008 07:14 |
luzr wrote on Tue, 22 April 2008 08:44 |
tvanriper wrote on Tue, 22 April 2008 08:09 |
I think that's a small issue. You can accomplish both your technical goals (fast, agile code) and still have the library 'feel' like it belongs as part of the standard template library.
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I am not quite sure about it being a "small issue".
IMO it all starts with reasons for String vs std::string...
Mirek
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This is where the peer review system is very helpful, I think.
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How do you think it could help to resolve this problem?
The real issue IMO is that boost is std:: extension, while U++ is std:: replacement... The basic design fundamentals and requirements are quite alien to std:: / boost concepts. Therefore I just fail to see how std:: replacement could do anything with boost.
Well, the only advantage would be to "get the attention", but I am not quite sure that is a good idea either....
(OTOH, peer review process itself is a very good idea, I wish we had something like that for U++ too...).
Mirek
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If I have it right, your primary concern with std:: involves its relatively terrible performance, and I think the technical issue had to do with the way you manipulate memory. If that's the concern, someone could potentially help you find a way to achieve the same performance you currently get with NTL, while using a more std::-like interface.
I could, of course, be mistaken. I'm not completely clear on why you feel these are so incompatible... as perhaps I'm not 100% clear on your design goals, or I'm ignorant of the fundamental problem you see in std::. I've read and re-read this page, but I still can't quite see how U++ and std:: can be so incompatible that there's no hope of improving the std::-style system to the point of matching U++ performance. I've certainly seen quite a few tricks used at boost:: that involved improving performance in a variety of ways (sometimes by providing a replacement for an existing library in std::, I think)... I should think they'd take quite a bit of interest in your techniques, and could possibly figure out a way to keep the same performance while making fewer changes to the existing interfaces.
I only pose this idea because it feels to me like you and boost have similar goals. I could, of course, be wrong. I know, for example, that boost has less of an emphasis on performance and more of an emphasis on their idea of 'correctness', so you may differ significantly there. (This is certainly not to say you have no concern for 'correctness', but that you may have a slightly different idea of what is 'correct' from boost).
You can best decide for yourself whether or not to approach them by reading some of the reviews people have left, and examine the decisions used to arrive at their conclusions.
Regardless, you could probably have your own peer-review system... it'd be interesting to see how people here would work with that. At the very least, such a system might help you gain some continuity between various objects in the U++ system.
As for gaining the attention of some of those heavy-hitters... well, there can be positive and negative results, to be sure. I thought it was possibly of interest to you only because you had mentioned attracting the attention of Stroustrup.
Perhaps someone could submit an article to Dr. Dobb's Journal showcasing the use of Ultimate++; that's a fairly popular magazine, at least here in the United States (the CUJ folded to Dr. Dobb's a few years ago, sadly, or I would have recommended it instead).
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Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: fudadmin on Wed, 07 December 2005 21:02
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: Garry on Sun, 08 January 2006 16:29
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: fudadmin on Sun, 08 January 2006 16:51
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: prof on Tue, 25 April 2006 05:41
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: riri on Tue, 25 April 2006 09:13
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: fudadmin on Tue, 25 April 2006 09:29
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Tue, 25 April 2006 09:32
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: riri on Tue, 25 April 2006 09:43
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: fudadmin on Tue, 25 April 2006 10:57
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Tue, 25 April 2006 09:50
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: riri on Tue, 25 April 2006 11:03
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: pivica on Thu, 27 April 2006 09:29
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: prof on Thu, 27 April 2006 21:07
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Thu, 27 April 2006 21:17
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: prof on Thu, 27 April 2006 22:19
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: unodgs on Thu, 27 April 2006 22:56
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: prof on Fri, 28 April 2006 00:34
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Fri, 28 April 2006 00:55
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: prof on Fri, 28 April 2006 01:22
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: cioannou on Wed, 25 October 2006 14:01
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Wed, 25 October 2006 14:25
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: cioannou on Wed, 25 October 2006 14:43
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Wed, 25 October 2006 14:56
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: cioannou on Wed, 25 October 2006 15:48
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: richardt on Thu, 26 October 2006 22:24
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Fri, 27 October 2006 01:36
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: richardt on Fri, 27 October 2006 10:39
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Wed, 25 October 2006 14:59
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: yeohhs on Wed, 25 October 2006 18:11
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: forlano on Wed, 25 October 2006 18:53
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: yeohhs on Sat, 28 October 2006 09:35
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Thu, 26 October 2006 01:07
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: yeohhs on Thu, 26 October 2006 01:55
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: cioannou on Thu, 26 October 2006 15:42
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: forlano on Wed, 25 October 2006 19:07
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Fri, 28 April 2006 00:39
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: forlano on Thu, 27 April 2006 21:59
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: yeohhs on Fri, 27 October 2006 11:23
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: agent86 on Mon, 25 December 2006 04:12
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: agent86 on Thu, 04 January 2007 08:17
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Sat, 19 July 2008 19:56
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Tue, 22 April 2008 14:44
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Fri, 25 April 2008 13:52
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mr_ped on Sat, 26 April 2008 03:23
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Sat, 26 April 2008 08:13
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Sat, 26 April 2008 08:11
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Sun, 27 April 2008 16:31
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: Novo on Sun, 27 April 2008 18:26
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Sun, 27 April 2008 18:49
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: unodgs on Tue, 17 June 2008 10:28
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Tue, 17 June 2008 13:46
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: Didier on Sun, 30 November 2008 23:09
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Sun, 30 November 2008 23:41
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: Didier on Thu, 04 December 2008 20:48
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Re: Which is the biggest drawback of U++ "unpopuliarity"?
By: mirek on Thu, 04 December 2008 23:27
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