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Home » Community » Coffee corner » Python for your applications
Python for your applications [message #19670] Sun, 04 January 2009 00:31 Go to next message
bytefield is currently offline  bytefield
Messages: 210
Registered: December 2007
Experienced Member
Hello,
I was thinking to use python with c++ programs, so I could benefit from python as scripting language, unicode support, sockets, etc.
I've tried some small test to see how python work with. Python 2.5.2 filled my 3 Gigs of memory in seconds and also 500 Mb from swap until i've killed it. With python 3 it finished the execution using just 2.5 MB of memory but it's time is not what i want Twisted Evil.
Python time

can@can-laptop:~$ time ./pytest.py

real 6m38.723s
user 6m28.628s
sys 0m0.600s


C++ time

can@can-laptop:~$ time ./cpptest

real 0m4.837s
user 0m4.696s
sys 0m0.020s



#!/usr/bin/env python3
# pytest.py
def fun(x):
	return x + 1
	
for x in range(0,1000000000):
	y = fun(x)

// cpptest.cpp
int fun(int x)
{
	return x + 1;
}

int main()
{
	for(int y, x = 0; x < 1000000000; x++)
		y = fun(x);
	return 0;
}

So, now after seeing those results i'm thinking not to use python embed in application. I'm curious what will be the results for usc? Hope better Smile

P.S.: I think the test are right, i've tried to not let C++ compiler to optimize it. If someone can provide other test which prove that python is though good as scripting side of a application please post them and try to convince me about the reality Razz


cdabbd745f1234c2751ee1f932d1dd75
Re: Python for your applications [message #19679 is a reply to message #19670] Sun, 04 January 2009 23:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sender Ghost is currently offline  Sender Ghost
Messages: 301
Registered: November 2008
Senior Member
Hello, Andrei.

I tested your test case on Windows XP 32 bit. My results are:
1. For 10000000
MSVC++ v9.0 SP1: 16 msec
Python v2.6.1: 3 sec, 156 msec
Python v3.0: 3 sec, 344 msec
2. For 100000000
MSVC++ v9.0 SP1: 47 msec
Python v2.6.1: 31 sec, 828 msec
Python v3.0: 33 sec, 578 msec
3. For 1000000000
MSVC++ v9.0 SP1: 422 msec
Python v2.6.1: MemoryError
Python v3.0: 5 min, 25 sec, 781 msec.

Memory consumption of Python v2.6.1 are large (about 1.5 Gb of 3.25 Gb accessible memory for this test case). Python v3.0 - about 268 Kb.

Because in Windows I haven't the time program for benchmarking I created following gettime program
// gettime.cpp
#include <Core/Core.h>

using namespace Upp;

String FormatElapsedTime(double run)
{
	String rtime;
	int msec = int(run) % 1000;
	run /= 1000;
	double hrs = floor(run / 3600);

	if (hrs > 0) rtime << NFormat("%0n hours, ", hrs);

	int minsec = fround(run - 3600 * hrs);
	int min = minsec / 60, sec = minsec % 60;

	if (min || hrs)	rtime << min << " min, ";
	if (sec || min) rtime << sec << " sec, ";
	
	rtime << msec << " msec";
	return rtime;
}

CONSOLE_APP_MAIN
{
	const Vector<String>& cmdline = CommandLine();

	if (cmdline.GetCount() == 0)
	{
		Cout() << "Not enough command line arguments\n";
		exit(0);
	}

	StringBuffer sb;

	for (int i = 0, n = cmdline.GetCount(); i < n; ++i)
	{
		sb << cmdline[i];
		if (i < n - 1) sb << " ";
	}
	
	String output;
	TimeStop ts;
	int exitCode = Sys(String(sb), output);
	double elapsed = ts.Elapsed();

	Cout() << "Elapsed: " << FormatElapsedTime(elapsed) << EOL
		<< "Exit code: " << AsString(exitCode) << EOL;

	if (!output.IsEmpty())	Cout() << "Output:\n" << output;
}


Then I compiled test case python script to optimized bytecode using following batch file (also with benchmarking):
rem benchmark.bat
SETLOCAL
SET Python26=C:\Python26
SET Python30=C:\Python30
SET DirectoryToCompile=%~p0

gettime cpptest

%Python26%\python -O %Python26%\Lib\compileall.py %DirectoryToCompile%
gettime %Python26%\python pytest.pyo
del *.pyo

%Python30%\python -O %Python30%\Lib\compileall.py %DirectoryToCompile%
gettime %Python30%\python pytest.pyo
del *.pyo


You can try Lua programming language. I created similar test case:
-- luatest.lua
function fun(x)
	return x + 1
end

for x = 0, 1000000000 do
	y = fun(x)
end

My results are:
1. For 10000000
Lua v5.1.4: 1 sec, 171 msec
2. For 100000000
Lua v5.1.4: 11 sec, 469 msec
3. For 1000000000
Lua v5.1.4: 1 min, 54 sec, 391 msec.

And memory consumption about 112 Kb.

Also for comparison purposes I created test cases for PHP
<?php
// phptest.php
function fun($x)
{
	return $x + 1;
}

for ($x = 0; $x < 1000000000; ++$x)
{
	$y = fun($x);
}
?>

and Perl:
# perltest.pl
sub fun
{
	my $x = shift;
	return $x + 1;
}

for my $x (0 .. 1000000000)
{
	my $y = fun($x);
}

with:
gettime php -n -f phptest.php
gettime perl perltest.pl


My results are:
1. For 10000000
PHP v5.2.8: 8 sec, 656 msec
Perl v5.10.0: 6 sec, 187 msec
2. For 100000000
PHP v5.2.8: 1 min, 15 sec, 78 msec
Perl v5.10.0: 1 min, 1 sec, 422 msec
3. For 1000000000
PHP v5.2.8: 12 min, 37 sec, 172 msec
Perl v5.10.0: 10 min, 14 sec, 157 msec.

Memory consumption:
PHP v5.2.8: 388 Kb
Perl v5.10.0: 268 Kb.

Added:
The correct cpptest.cpp file are follows:
int fun(int x)
{
	return x + 1;
}

int main()
{
	int y;

	for(int x = 0; x < 1000000000; ++x)
	{
		y = fun(x);
	}

	return y;
}


And what about C++ (or JavaScript) interpreter embedded into your program? Examples: Ch, CINT C/C++ Interpreter.

Added:
1. For 10000000
Cint v5.16.19: 5 sec, 703 msec
2. For 100000000
Cint v5.16.19: 47 sec, 562 msec
3. For 1000000000
Cint v5.16.19: 7 min, 44 sec, 719 msec.

Memory consumption of Cint v5.16.19: 260 Kb.

Updated and added:
Result table:
#  Name
1. MSVC++ v9.0 SP1
2. GNU GCC v4.2.4 TDM-1
3. Python v2.6.1
4. Python v2.6.1 with xrange
5. Python v3.0
6. Lua v5.1.4
7. PHP v5.2.8
8. Perl v5.10.0
9. Cint v5.16.19

#  10000000         100000000               1000000000
1. 16 msec          47 msec                 422 msec
2. 31 msec          31 msec                 31 msec
3. 3 sec, 156 msec  31 sec, 828 msec        MemoryError
4. 3 sec, 860 msec  28 sec, 938 msec        4 min, 38 sec, 157 msec
5. 3 sec, 344 msec  33 sec, 578 msec        5 min, 25 sec, 781 msec
6. 1 sec, 171 msec  11 sec, 469 msec        1 min, 54 sec, 391 msec
7. 8 sec, 656 msec  1 min, 15 sec, 78 msec  12 min, 37 sec, 172 msec
8. 6 sec, 187 msec  1 min, 1 sec, 422 msec  10 min, 14 sec, 157 msec
9. 5 sec, 703 msec  47 sec, 562 msec        7 min, 44 sec, 719 msec

[Updated on: Tue, 06 January 2009 23:58]

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Re: Python for your applications [message #19680 is a reply to message #19679] Mon, 05 January 2009 09:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bytefield is currently offline  bytefield
Messages: 210
Registered: December 2007
Experienced Member
Thanks, I appreciate your efforts to test interpreted languages and I have to say that I'm impressed about Lua results. It's pity that massive usage of function calls is that expensive in python, i liked features provided by this languages. Perhaps python will work good too as scripting side of an app. or as standalone language while wrapping heavy parts written in C/C++ to gain full speed at functions calls, benefit from C/C++ compiler optimizations and run parts that usually you can't write in interpreted languages.
I've think at python languages as it is world wide used and his features doesn't force you to reinvent the wheel to have them.
Compared to python, lua have better performances but lack of some features available for python. For example is much simple so use boost python to embed C++ classes in python than using API provided by lua to embed C++ classes in it. The comparison could continue with lua std library vs. python std lib.
I don't know, now i'm hesitate to choose one instead of other, features or speed?


cdabbd745f1234c2751ee1f932d1dd75
Re: Python for your applications [message #19681 is a reply to message #19670] Mon, 05 January 2009 10:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
qapko is currently offline  qapko
Messages: 53
Registered: October 2007
Location: Slovakia
Member
Hi,
I'm using Python as embedded language for U++ projects and it's great! In U++/C++ I do only GUI and routines that must be optimized for speed. Configuration files and possibly all routines of the function engine of the application are in Python - application is thus configurable and modifiable in Pythonic way, which is simply enjoying. If you are interested in embedding Python in C++ you may look for PyCXX or some other project for wrapping Python API to objects/methods in C++.
Also please look for the difference between range and xrange in Python 2.6. The things are not that bad at all when you know what you are doing Wink

Gabi
Re: Python for your applications [message #19682 is a reply to message #19681] Mon, 05 January 2009 12:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mirek is currently offline  mirek
Messages: 13442
Registered: November 2005
Ultimate Member
qapko wrote on Mon, 05 January 2009 04:33


Hi,
I'm using Python as embedded language for U++ projects and it's great!



Should we offer something in U++ for python? Would you contribute?

Mirek
Re: Python for your applications [message #19683 is a reply to message #19680] Mon, 05 January 2009 14:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sender Ghost is currently offline  Sender Ghost
Messages: 301
Registered: November 2008
Senior Member
bytefield wrote on Mon, 05 January 2009 13:59


I don't know, now i'm hesitate to choose one instead of other, features or speed?

Thanks, for your test case. It's your choice what to do right. For more detailed comparisons you can see The Computer Language Benchmarks Game site.

[Updated on: Mon, 05 January 2009 14:01]

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Re: Python for your applications [message #19703 is a reply to message #19682] Tue, 06 January 2009 14:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
cocob is currently offline  cocob
Messages: 156
Registered: January 2008
Experienced Member
Good idea, If you are interested i already have a upp package for python26.

cocob
Re: Python for your applications [message #19704 is a reply to message #19703] Tue, 06 January 2009 15:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tojocky is currently offline  tojocky
Messages: 607
Registered: April 2008
Location: UK
Contributor

cocob wrote on Tue, 06 January 2009 15:25

Good idea, If you are interested i already have a upp package for python26.

cocob

Maybe you attach the example here?

[Updated on: Tue, 06 January 2009 15:05]

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Re: Python for your applications [message #19712 is a reply to message #19670] Tue, 06 January 2009 22:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sender Ghost is currently offline  Sender Ghost
Messages: 301
Registered: November 2008
Senior Member
My first post on this thread was updated.
- Added GNU GCC v4.2.4 TDM-1 results for C++.
- PHP was running with -n parameter to exclude impact of php.ini configuration.
- Updated results with new gettime program.
- Added result table.

[Updated on: Tue, 06 January 2009 23:59]

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Re: Python for your applications [message #19717 is a reply to message #19682] Wed, 07 January 2009 10:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
qapko is currently offline  qapko
Messages: 53
Registered: October 2007
Location: Slovakia
Member
luzr wrote on Mon, 05 January 2009 12:30



Should we offer something in U++ for python? Would you contribute?

Mirek


Maybe I can make some example application that will demonstrate binding Python engine with U++ GUI. Or did you mean something like U++/Python bindings package? I thing there is no need to provide it. I use only C++/Python bindings in my U++ projects and personally have no idea on what this U++/Python package should do. Have anyone here looked at PyCXX's web site? I was highly inspired by this package when starting using Python in U++.
If you have any questions on using Python in C++ or U++ I'm ready to give you the answers or at least provide some help.

Gabi
Re: Python for your applications [message #19728 is a reply to message #19682] Wed, 07 January 2009 17:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sender Ghost is currently offline  Sender Ghost
Messages: 301
Registered: November 2008
Senior Member
luzr wrote on Mon, 05 January 2009 16:30


Should we offer something in U++ for python? Would you contribute?

Mirek

Hello, Mirek.

You can start from reading documentation for Python programming language, e.g. "Embedding Python in Another Application" (v2.6, v3.0). Also this approach works for Lua programming language: "Extending your Application" and Perl: "How to embed perl in your C program".

[Updated on: Wed, 07 January 2009 17:24]

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Re: Python for your applications [message #19732 is a reply to message #19717] Wed, 07 January 2009 23:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mindtraveller is currently offline  Mindtraveller
Messages: 917
Registered: August 2007
Location: Russia, Moscow rgn.
Experienced Contributor

qapko wrote on Wed, 07 January 2009 12:20

Maybe I can make some example application that will demonstrate binding Python engine with U++ GUI.

Binding Python with U++ GUI is very interesting. It would be great to see it.
Re: Python for your applications [message #19733 is a reply to message #19732] Thu, 08 January 2009 02:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
captainc is currently offline  captainc
Messages: 278
Registered: December 2006
Location: New Jersey, USA
Experienced Member
I have also used embedded Python much in a very large project. It wasn't used with a gui though, just command line. I used the Paramiko SFTP module to provide as SFTP server and client as well as using Python as a way to extend the application's functionality (to perform data transformations). I also used Py2Exe to package the entire interpreter along with the program. My memory footprint was not over 10 MB and performance was good, and it was running in a Virtual Box VM.

I'll post some of the code when I get a chance again.

Just be careful with threading and embedded python, it can get tricky.
Re: Python for your applications [message #19809 is a reply to message #19670] Fri, 23 January 2009 10:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
qapko is currently offline  qapko
Messages: 53
Registered: October 2007
Location: Slovakia
Member
Hello,
I'm sending my ConnSrv application for everybody interested in embedding Python in U++. It's quite simple server used for routing TCP/IP connections on the host PC. It uses threading and saves its configuration in Python source file. I hope you can run it on the PC without Python installed - it uses Python 2.5.2 and some core parts of it are included. It can be run as is, "connsrv.exe" file is in the "tst" directory.
I'm ready to respond if you have any questions about the way it works.

Have a nice day.
Gabi
  • Attachment: connsrv.zip
    (Size: 601.26KB, Downloaded 295 times)
Re: Python for your applications [message #19810 is a reply to message #19809] Fri, 23 January 2009 10:41 Go to previous message
qapko is currently offline  qapko
Messages: 53
Registered: October 2007
Location: Slovakia
Member
Hi,
I'm sorry - in previous attached "connsrv.zip" there are not "python25.dll" and "mfc71.dll" that are needed for running the application without Python 2.5 installed. So here they are. You must copy them to "tst" directory.

Gabi

[Updated on: Fri, 23 January 2009 10:43]

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